What's your history? I know you've worked with reggae producer Nick Manasseh in the past.
I played in band when I was a kid and then kind of got tired of that. As a reaction, I went into completely electronic stuff and thought, "I'm not going to play the guitar any more." Then I did a lot of club stuff for quite a while. Eventually I found the guitar again and tried to join them together. I got signed as an "artist" to Virgin in 2001. There was a period when they were signing producers as artists — you do an album, make the tracks, and get people to sing on each of them. I think Zero 7 had been massive and Virgin was like, "You could be just like them."
There's always someone you are supposed to be "just like."
Yeah, exactly. It didn't really amount to much.
Was that under your name?
[It was actually] Mr. Dan. They let me be pretty out there. The record I made didn't sell, but it was quite interesting. That was where I got the cash to build up the desk and tape machine. I met lots of vocalists who sang on my album, but it made more sense for me to produce their records. That's the way it should be. [Icelandic singer] Emiliana Torrini was probably the first person I had a record with [Fisherman's Woman]. I have done a lot of stuff with her, and that's branched out into other things. Together we wrote a song ["Slow'] for Kylie [Minogue] in the middle of doing Emiliana's album. Someone suggested it at the label and I thought it would be fun. That did pretty well, so that led to a whole other kind of area of production.
What initially led to you learning how to engineer? Was that involving Nick too?
I used to do reggae guitar sessions for him. He would let me sit around in the studio while he was carrying on mixing the track. I used to hang around and ask questions. I had some kind of setup at home previous to that, but I learned a lot from Nick about doing things properly. Then we ended up sharing a studio in Brixton; it was too big for one person so we moved in there together.
You had different suites to work out of?
Exactly. I think I had a slight thing for engineering. I did electronics at the university, thinking it would enable me to build anything.
Like build your own console or something?
Yeah. I probably shouldn't have spent so much time in bands!
One thing I hear in your productions are certain dub techniques.
I used to love the records that Nick was doing — he was just matter-of-fact about it, "When you set up an echo, you've got to have it feeding back on itself. You've got to filter, and you need some spring reverbs." But at the same time that you have all these spacey, float-y sounds, you always have the kick drum really loud, and always have the vocal nice and present. That's the style I guess. That led into other things. I spent a bit of time with Sly [Dunbar] and Robbie [Shakespeare] in Kingston, Jamaica, and then did some stuff with Lee Perry as well. Because of the way that Nick showed me how music "should be made," I get into trouble sometimes. I always have this tendency to do what he would do, like towards the end of a track it'll start turning into a dub version. [laughter] Often labels come back and say, "It is great, but it just goes crazy at the end and there are all these echoes." And I'm like, "Yeah, obviously." I thought that's what you were meant to do. Often I have to go back and do mixes again without going crazy. I can never let a mix go through without changing it somehow. Even when the automation is doing all of the business, I can't help but do one little [reverb] hit.
What kind of stuff did you do with Lee Perry?
He did vocals on a track. I am in a band called Lazyboy — it's me and Rob da Bank. We wrote a song and it reminded us of Perry, so he did a vocal on it. He said, "Only if you come to my house." Mad Professor [Neil Fraser] took me over there and it was a crazy, crazy day. I had some kind of digital 24-track, just with the track on it. It wouldn't plug in; Lee plugged it in with some little bits of wire. He got the wires off the mains cable and it kept going on and off. Eventually he adjusted it to where it worked. We had done this song and sent it to him and he had two ideas. Instead of doing lots of takes and then choosing the ones he liked, he did two takes. But he probably listened to each one 15 or 20 times, and this song is about six minutes long! He did another take and listened to that 15 times and then said, "It's the first one." [laughter]
You have an "additional production" credit on The Kills' record, Blood Pressures. I know they tracked that at Key Club Recording Company in Michigan.
Yeah, we only did little bits here. They had been at Key Club for ages and then came here. We did quite a lot of reamping of drums that had been played on the [Akai] MPC. We sent the kick out to a bass amp. We went back to Key Club — it was definitely mostly done there. Have you been there? It's just amazing. The whole building has got this feel. I suppose it's because there is lots of room in the studio. There's a control room, a live room, and a room behind that with logs around it, which is like being in a forest of amps. Then there are a couple of small booths, but it kind of extends out into the kitchen. Music is just everywhere.
Have you spent much time working in sterile studios?
No. I try not to. I feel really lost when I go to a high- end, good-looking studio — for lots of reasons. Partly not having instant access to all of the instruments, but also I feel a kind of pressure. If it looks too expensive then I worry about touching anything, or wasting too much time. It's quite interesting talking to people who finish recording here. They mention those kinds of things, like the fact that it doesn't really feel like you're in a studio. They seem to like it. It's interesting having found Key Club — I would definitely go there because it felt similar. I think maybe it's a deficiency of mine, but there is something about having all your own equipment — you know how to abuse things slightly, or you know the difference between hooking up a different signal path for the drum busses and exactly what it will do. Most things don't just sound great as soon as you turn them on.
Does your studio ever surprise someone that the label passes your way?
I think people seem really excited to see my place. People from labels come down and always say, "I've got to get so-and-so to come over here." I think some people are surprised when I tell them that I mix here, because I guess you might expect a mixing room to have less distractions. We are starting another room around the corner actually — it's like a two or three minute walk. It's about the size of this and we are going to use it mainly for mixing, and maybe some overdubs. I've got a pretty similar set of outboard gear, as well as a Calrec desk. That's partly to free up a bit of time, because if I mix in here and then have to recall it, it's a pain in the ass. Because so many people mix in the computer, I think labels are getting used to feeling that it's okay to not really decide. I've been trying to force people to get involved in the decision-making. Often the next day it's like, "Can we just try this?" And I say, "No. I've just taken it off." So we thought if we had another room, we could have a song and leave it for a few days. We could go work in the other studio for a bit and do something there while leaving the other mix up.
That's real recall, walk over and the same mix is still up. [laughter]
It's a bit of a luxury. Yesterday it was really good as well. We were recording in here and I took another song that needed a bit of attention over to the other space for a few hours. Alexis [Smith, Dan's assistant] was here in the studio recording some vocals. It's nice. I think it is good for everyone's state of mind. If you've got five people in a room, not everyone can be doing something; but if you split it into two rooms then everyone is busy. If I'm working with a band, I prefer it if everyone is in here and doing something. It maximizes that potential and everyone is quite happy. It can get quite boring if you've done your bit of tracking.
That sounds like a pretty good plan. Do you ever do stem mixes for recalls?
It doesn't work for me.
What did you find that didn't work? I have been doing that a bit recently.
I find that if you bypass the stereo bus (compression or EQ), then everything sounds weak because there is not enough level, mainly because of the way it goes through the stereo bus compression or EQ. But if you put the drums through the stereo compression then it's all too compressed and it doesn't sit right when you put it together [with the other stems]. It's gone through the desk too many times as well. What I do more often is, when I'm mixing, or even before the mixing, I try to reduce things a bit so there's not a massive multitrack. I try to put the drums into approximately four tracks, such as kick and a snare. Everything else is as a pair.
Like sub-mixing, with processing along the way?
Yeah. Decide on a sound, so if you have to recall it you don't have tons of work. I like bouncing things around on tape.
I have many projects where I am mixing remotely.
You need two studios. [laughter]
